Re: [Libre-silicon-devel] [Libre-soc-dev] Invitation: (No Subject) @ Thu Nov 18, 2021 8am - 12pm (GMT) (libre-soc-dev@lists.libre-soc.org)
i just received word from NLnet that there's a strategic meeting to discuss the impact of NGI / NLnet Grants and to plan ahead for potential future EU Grants. with EUR 120 billion earmarked for Digital Sovereignty in Europe, even ideas such as creating 3D Printed ASIC Packaging and bonding wire equipment are the sorts of things that could - and should - be raised. https://www.ngi.eu/event/next-generation-internet-ngi-next-steps/?instance_i...
Hi Luke I've got an idea... Although our team is by now rather dominated by software developers, we still have actual engineers in the team :-) Maybe we should step the whole thing up a notch and propose a project for develeping actual equipment they can use in clean rooms. You mentioned bonding... we could however finally start get hands on with the maskless stepper aligner project, or we could use those many already existing open source designs for magnetron sputtering machines and manufacture something which can be produced in mass. If they give us the cash for getting started, like the parts for the prototyping and the equipment, I'll gladly turn that into a legitimate business. Cheers -lev On Monday, November 15, 2021 2:31:38 PM WET lkcl wrote:
i just received word from NLnet that there's a strategic meeting to discuss the impact of NGI / NLnet Grants and to plan ahead for potential future EU Grants. with EUR 120 billion earmarked for Digital Sovereignty in Europe, even ideas such as creating 3D Printed ASIC Packaging and bonding wire equipment are the sorts of things that could - and should - be raised.
https://www.ngi.eu/event/next-generation-internet-ngi-next-steps/?instance_i d=573 _______________________________________________ Libresilicon-developers mailing list Libresilicon-developers@list.libresilicon.com https://list.libresilicon.com/mailman/listinfo/libresilicon-developers
-- (\__/) (='.'=) This is Ninja Bunny. (")_(") Copy and paste Bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination
On Mon, Nov 15, 2021 at 3:51 PM David Lanzendörfer <leviathan@libresilicon.com> wrote:
Hi Luke I've got an idea... Although our team is by now rather dominated by software developers, we still have actual engineers in the team :-)
good god.
Maybe we should step the whole thing up a notch and propose a project for develeping actual equipment they can use in clean rooms.
there's EUR 120 billion earmarked for Digital Sovereignty, so there really are no limits here - not of money, at least. and, with things like this IC not being available - at all - despite it being an absolutely crucial component in Diesel Engine ECUs - because it's 250 nm high current high voltage near-military-grade standards, and the entire Foundry equipment which was single-suppliier was SCRAPPED because the frickin Automotive Industry stopped ordering... https://www.st.com/en/automotive-analog-and-power/l9966.html#sample-buy ... it really should not be difficult to convince these bureaucrats that this is urgent, urgent, urgent to get a *full* Sovereign-Independent IC supply chain. (everything: not just the equipment but the know-how. it's great that Intel want to create Foundries in Europe, but if they embed C4 in the walls and then blow it up, or just open all the doors leading to the Class I Cleanroom, or wipe the computers remotely at the order of the U.S. Govt because Intel is a US Corporation, that's not really Digital Sovereignty)
If they give us the cash for getting started, like the parts for the prototyping and the equipment, I'll gladly turn that into a legitimate business.
the idea of this meeting is not to ask for money, but to diplomatically suggest, "hey y'know if there was this EU Call which had this this and this in it theeeenn, like, y'knooow, there's these people called NGI? y'know? they might like, y'know, put in a Grant Request?" it all has to be done at 3rd hand, so that it is all independent and impartial and you get the general gist. l.
On Nov 15, 2021, at 09:12, lkcl <luke.leighton@gmail.com> wrote: […] and, with things like this IC not being available - at all - despite it being an absolutely crucial component in Diesel Engine ECUs - because it's 250 nm high current high voltage near-military-grade standards, and the entire Foundry equipment which was single-suppliier was SCRAPPED because the frickin Automotive Industry stopped ordering...
This sounds like the type of project to start on for the equipment and process development. Bigger feature sizes, less complex packaging and sturdy part. I’d be for publishing the information we learn, our tricks and “secret sauce” in some suitable open fashion: whether it be a Creative Commons license or something else. If we do, this could be a gigantic revolution in education for the next several classes of engineering students: undergraduate and graduate! (Provided we can enlist enough engineering professors who aren’t beholden to an NDA from some existing semiconductor fab or equipment manufacturer and are willing to publish results instead of patenting them.) Richard
On Mon, Nov 15, 2021, 08:46 Richard Wilbur <richard.wilbur@gmail.com> wrote:
On Nov 15, 2021, at 09:12, lkcl <luke.leighton@gmail.com> wrote: […] and, with things like this IC not being available - at all - despite it being an absolutely crucial component in Diesel Engine ECUs - because it's 250 nm high current high voltage near-military-grade standards, and the entire Foundry equipment which was single-suppliier was SCRAPPED because the frickin Automotive Industry stopped ordering...
This sounds like the type of project to start on for the equipment and process development. Bigger feature sizes, less complex packaging and sturdy part.
I’d be for publishing the information we learn, our tricks and “secret sauce” in some suitable open fashion: whether it be a Creative Commons license or something else. If we do, this could be a gigantic revolution in education for the next several classes of engineering students: undergraduate and graduate! (Provided we can enlist enough engineering professors who aren’t beholden to an NDA from some existing semiconductor fab or equipment manufacturer and are willing to publish results instead of patenting them.)
One person we probably want to ask if they want to help out is Sam Zeloof, he has a YouTube channel where he publishes videos about him building his own chips at home: https://youtube.com/c/SamZeloof Another person we'd want to ask is https://youtube.com/c/HuygensOptics who has experience making oleds and optical equipment needed for making asics (he mostly uses them for making nickel(?) masks for optics experiments, rather than electronics though) I'd also be interested in helping, I have quite a bit of knowledge of chemistry (though little practical experience) and >20yr of experience building electronics, mostly as a hobby. I've been working on Libre-SOC for about 3 years now. Unfortunately, I won't be able to attend the meeting, since it's very early morning for me. Jacob
Hi
the idea of this meeting is not to ask for money, but to diplomatically suggest, "hey y'know if there was this EU Call which had this this and this in it theeeenn, like, y'knooow, there's these people called NGI? y'know? they might like, y'know, put in a Grant Request?"
it all has to be done at 3rd hand, so that it is all independent and impartial and you get the general gist. So... we gotta tip toe around the fact that their supply chain is fucked and that they should give us the cash to fix it? xD
-lev
participants (4)
-
David Lanzendörfer -
Jacob Lifshay -
lkcl -
Richard Wilbur